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Joined: 2/27/2011
Posts: 353
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(Warning: Some responses to the conversation below may contain possible triggers for some of you.)
In a much of genre fiction, the main characters are subject to quite a lot of abuse over the course of the novel. I recently read Robin Hobb's Farseer trilogy and my heart was breaking at several points at the torments that Fitz experiences over the course of the three books. Likewise, in many of the crime fiction novels I read, the main character is abused, shot, stab, raped, etc. There was one particular Val McDermid novel I actually had to stop reading for a while because of this.
It got me to thinking: what line won't you cross with your characters, either main characters or side characters, when it comes to telling your story? What is completely off the table?
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Joined: 3/16/2011
Posts: 279
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Great discussion topic!
I know which Val McDermid book you're referring to and it gave me a few bad moments while reading it.
There aren't a lot of lines I'm willing to draw and say I will never do, but child abuse in any form is one of them.
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Joined: 3/13/2011
Posts: 244
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Sex. Language. Only because I don't feel like I need that in my head. (And I don't swear in real life so it feels weird writing it.)
If I'm not comfortable reading it I'm not comfortable writing it. I tend to gloss over actual descriptions of any character getting hurt and just go with the aftermath. Like if someone's being whipped nearby you hear the scream and see the blood on their shirt back afterward.
There's one other but it's not a can of worms I'm willing to open here.
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Ooh tough question! I've read books that cross every kind of boundary--murder, rape, emotional/physical abuse--the list goes on. But I don't think it's necessarily about taking certain topics off the table--if they exist in the real world, they should be able to exist in the written world. The "line" is in the telling. Whether or not it's "acceptable" is how these horrific things are portrayed, what implications are attached, what tone they're given. That's the real issue, I think--how (and why) the disturbing scene is being written.
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Joined: 4/28/2011
Posts: 60
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I have to agree with Danielle. The line is definitely in the telling. I think writing a scene where something absolutely terrible happens to the main character must be one of the most difficult things to do for an author. I think the trick is in getting across the emotion and sense of the thing without going into so much detail that it becomes prurient. This is especially the case when dealing with such sensitive and volatile events as rape and child abuse. As it happens, both of those things (and much more) happened to one of the characters in my WIP, but it all happened 'off-screen,' so to speak, before the main events of the novel. That's one way to deal with it. Just don't describe it at all. Describe only the aftermath, although I understand this approach might not work in all--or even most--cases.
I have to say that sometimes, however, I get so personally attached to my characters that I just don't want bad things to happen to them and I start to shy away from torturing them. Then I have to sit down and ask myself, is it really necessary for the plot for me to ______ to them or can I get away with not having ______ happen. And that's the real crux of the issue. Is it necessary for the plot and the character?
So, yes, the line is in the telling. But it's also in the plotting and sometimes it's just necessary to beat the characters up a bit. Otherwise, we face the ridiculousness of having characters walk through a war-zone and come out the other end with nothing but a stubbed toe and a three-day growth of beard.
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Joined: 6/7/2011
Posts: 467
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Meanest thing I ever did to a character was have someone she was falling in love with die in a terrible, senseless accident. Sorry, my dear, the plot demanded it. But if I do a sequel, I promise, you'll find somebody new. If not, you'll just pine away forever and ever.
Seriously, if plot demanded a violent disembowelment, I'm pretty sure I could write it. A graphic rape? Probably not. Like LR said, off screen. I may be a little squeamish but I frequently run into unexpected scenes in movies that I wish had happened off screen.
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Joined: 8/22/2011
Posts: 14
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Interesting thread!
For me it is all about what the point of the upsetting subject matter is and how it is handled. Joyce Carol Oates and Margaret Atwood are two of my favorite authors and they frequently write about dark and disturbing topics but do it extremely well and it never seems to be just for its own sake- it is crucial to the plot or theme or to drive home a point. I normally have a very hard time reading about child abuse and this is a frequent topic in JCO's short stories and it doesn't bother me- I mean it bothers me in that it makes me think after but not bothers me as in it really disturbs me.
I really didn't like the Steig Larrson novels because I felt like a lot of the stuff was just there to be shocking- all the rape and torture scenes. I understand that they made Lisbeth who she was and some parts were part of the plot but overall I found it gave me the creeps and not in a good way.
I realize I have gone off tangent and am talking more about what I read than what I write. Right now my WIP is directed at YA/MG so it will be pretty light(although there will definitely be a few deaths) but past projects have gotten pretty dark. For writing I stand by with how I feel about what I read- if it has a purpose and is handled with care anything can be written about. I personally would really struggle with writing about child abuse/molestation.
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Joined: 4/27/2011
Posts: 608
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For me the line is this: any extended sadistic, graphic, gut-wrenching scene of cruelty and violence that serves no other purpose than shock-for-shock's sake—or what is worse: demented violent vignettes that communicate to the reader the writer’s secret joy and perverse glee in crafting such psychologically-devastating scenes. Such writing becomes a kind of death-porn, an amoral sledge-hammering of the reader’s sensibilities simply because the writer CAN.
I have written many a violent, graphic scene but each and every one served an important purpose: to advance the plot and concretize and make real to the reader the stakes the characters are battling for/against. I hope that my readers appreciate the artistry with which these scenes are constructed and described, as I appreciate the work of Stephen King and Robert E. Howard and Thomas Harris and so many others. (Not that I’m comparing my midnight scritch-scribblings to theirs, you understand!)
This is a key, critical point with me: You (the writer) are an artist; so for god’s sakes show some ARTISTRY in your staging and exposition of violent scenes. Any fool can shock: just write with unflinching graphicness about chainsaws sundering skulls, razors ripping flesh, forks plunging into eyeballs, etc. The thematic elements and emotional coloring and just, judicious arrangement of evocative sensory details creatively invoked should, however—if executed with any degree of authorial skill—help to transmute the raw savagery of the violence into something the reader can appreciate and applaud on a “consummate craftsman” level, i.e.; kinetic ballet or “Grand Guignol” theatrical staging, etc. It is the artist’s artistry in describing scenes of torture, assorted mayhem and violent death that will make the book palatable, endurable and—dare I say it?—enjoyable to the reader—or not.
Two final thoughts:
(1) What comes before and after scenes of violence are more important than the scenes of violence themselves. That is to say—we, the reader, will judge the humanity, decency, empathy and moral intelligence of the writer by the stance (often communicated to the reader via subtext) they take toward their own material.
(2) I am going to single out one particular writer and one particular book here because it serves as the exemplum of where I draw the line when submitting my psyche to authorial-administered shocks in the service of art appreciation. The writer is Bret Easton Ellis; the book: AMERICAN PSYCHO. I opened the novel one day in a bookstore (having pulled the book off the shelf at random) and happened upon the scene in which the protagonist entertains himself with a nude woman, a length of hamster Habit Trail tubing, battery acid and a starved rat. That bit was enough for me; I forever cured myself of any future interest in the works of Mr. Ellis. I don’t condemn the man for writing it; I don’t think the less of his many fans or adoring critics who applaud the genius of his writing; I’m simply stating here and now that I find it hard to continue reading when my gut has congealed into balled ice and sweat is running down my face and I find that I am fighting to keep the gorge from rising in my mouth.
In conclusion: What line won’t I cross with my characters? The line clearly marked: Death-torture Porn.
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Joined: 5/12/2011
Posts: 240
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I hesitate to say there's a specific thing I won't write, but there are certain tropes I watch out for. In the fiction of this culture, certain types of people seem to be fodder for violence and abuse over and over and I get tired of that. I get tired of the death of a woman (usually post-rape) which then inspires the hero to vengeance. I get tired of Black women and children being disposable, or symbolic of a social ill (or seven) rather than actual, real people with depth of character.
One reason I don't read mysteries is because so often, when I've picked one up, the opening is the violent death of a stereotypically attractive woman. Sometimes it's a child. Sometimes it's a series of killings of such women or children.
Using the same types of people over and over as victims just underscores assumptions in our society that make us shrug our shoulders in real life when bad things happen to certain kinds of people. We assume they are the victim class. I'm not interested in contributing to that.
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Joined: 3/13/2011
Posts: 222
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I don't have a specific line. However, there are things I will only _gloss over_ or _mention_, but not describe in detail. Example, sex + children. In a culture in my book, it is perfectly acceptable for men to take wives around age 12 and older. People just don't live as long in the culture. They marry early, they die early. Now, there is one character that takes it further beyond what even the society thinks is acceptable... and I kill him off in a rather satisfying fashion.
I crossed that line, but it is ALL about the presentation. You can make it very clear something is going on, and frankly, the reader's imagination can dream up things far, far worse than my own. I prefer to let people create their own worst scenario and hint at what _might_ have been. All without explicitly detailing it. You don't have to ram it in a reader's face for people to get it.
I avoid foul language in my books -- if I use it, it is mild.I don't want parents ashamed of their child finding a book I wrote on the floor. Sex... it happens, but I gloss. I'm not writing an erotica, so it doesn't need to be in there. Adult situations will come up, but I try to avoid the explicit line. That said, I'm not shy about chopping a dude's head off, tossing it in a bag and flinging it around. That's just how i...er.. roll.
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Joined: 8/28/2011
Posts: 7
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I've lost a couple proof readers because of some things that I write. I've gotten this twice by co-workers "What the **** is wrong with you" and "Your sick"
It's a horrible thing to hear actually.
But I think that there are no boundaries. I don't want to just gloss over a scene because it's a touchy subject. It just doesn't have the same effect that way.
For example: Rape. I read a book and fell in love with the main character. I didn't want anything bad to happen to him, he got raped by another man and the author wrote it with detail (Not smutty detail or anything) and the whole time I was worried about the character while reading. I wanted him to escape. Wanted it to be a dream. SOMETHING! Anyways, point is that it brought out more emotion from me when I was reading it. He could have just glossed over the scene but it wouldn't have stuck with me like it had. I almost felt like I got raped.
Nothing is out of the question when it comes to my writing. I just have to accept that my audience will be smaller.
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Joined: 4/27/2011
Posts: 26
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I don't know why, but I try to add a WTF scene whenever I come up with one and try to look for a chapter where the scene will actually contribute to the plot. Crotch stabs appear multiple times, but I don't add profanity. I know nothing about sex, so that's off limits, but violence is a different matter. I remember my English teacher telling my classmate to not lend me a Swiss knife just to be on the safe side.
I will cross the line if it helps the plot, but I try to go for a WTF scene if it contributes to the plot. One line that I will try not to cross is an ultimatum death/sex. For those of you who don't read comics, Ultimatum was a big event in Marvel comics where the main heroes just die. No struggle. No epic fights. Just gruesome deaths meant to gross out the reader. It doesn't even contribute to the plot.
If there will be a day where I will work on a sex scene, I will avoid a nu52 Starfire sex scene. Basically, a mindless character having sex just to add boobs. NO important plot point. It even made a three dimensional character turn into a mindless slut that was there to attract attention.
I like things that shock people, but I hate it if it was pointless.
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Joined: 4/30/2011
Posts: 662
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I don't think there is a line I won't cross. I use profanity if it fits the character. I have sex, rape, murder, and torture. If the plot calls for it, then I use it, but I don't do it so I have the opportunity to write a graphic scene. I use enough detail to get the point across or deal in the aftermath. I have a scene in the first chapter of my WIP that butchers 5 guys before they commit their crime. The first attack is when one of their backs is turned. To me that is more terrible then talking about a body splitting open and their intestines spilling out on the ground with explicit detail. How or why the act is committed should be the thing that gets to the reader. Motivation (or lack there of) is what drives the story.
When it comes to sex I don't get graphic because, face it, sex is gross and comical (at least to me). Consider the faces you make and the fluids... There is something animalistic that I just can't make romantic. I'm not prudish or anything like that, but I roll my eyes at graphic sex scenes. They just seem unnecessary.
As for my own characters now, I think the only thing I haven't done is child abuse and drug addiction. My MC is a rape "victim" (she hates that word) who will murder abusers in cold blood, a chain smoking priest who swears like a sailor, a prince trained like he's SpecOps who suffers from insomnia, and an outlaw who isn't afraid to "interrogate" others for information. I've realized I'm not very good at writing characters who are balanced and happy, but then they wouldn't be interesting.
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Joined: 4/30/2011
Posts: 662
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@CatchCan: "I always felt that writing is one part english teacher, and two parts psychologist."
I agree with this. How characters act in a situation often determines if the reader/audience will be able to believe what is going on. When it comes to what you as a writer are willing to do, I guess it also means what you are willing to make your characters cope with. Sometimes it can be just as hard to write a deplorable character as having one of your favorites end up the victim of a horrendous act. Well, at least it is for me.
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Joined: 5/12/2011
Posts: 240
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"one part English teacher, two parts psychologist"--love it!
: )
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Joined: 8/22/2011
Posts: 14
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Interestingly enough a movie pertaining to this topic is coming out in 2012- The Raven. It is about a murderer who fashions his murders based on short stories and poems written by Edgar Allan Poe. There is a line in the preview where the policeman says something to the effect of "there is no doubt that these killings have been inspired from your imagination" so Poe is partly to blame.
I'm not saying that people shouldn't write horrible about torture etc because some crazy person might then try to recreate it in real life but it is interesting to think about. On the flip side of that some horrible things that do happen in life need to be written about- a good example of this is City of God by Paulo Lins. There is so much graphic violence and rape and baby murdering in this book but he was depicting a real part of the world. Probably a little extreme but he wanted to bring attention to it- and it certainly worked.
I wonder what, if any, boundaries Poe had for his characters in his poems and short stories? I think he was a master at depicting murderous events in a way that added meaning and depth to the poem or story.
You can see the preview for The Raven here.
http://dailygoodthing.blogspot.com/2011/10/literary-gothic-horror-romance-murder.html
I personally am BEYOND excited for it! Love when lit and film collide.
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Joined: 11/17/2011
Posts: 21
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I agree that the situation must fit the character and the plot, but frankly I would not describe a lot in detail. Rape, torture, gore and even violence can all be described in terms that allow the reader to understand what is happening without rubbing their collective faces in it. In so many cases, graphic descriptions of violence leave me cold.
I don't write about sex, rape or violence unless they are necessary to the narrative. For many years, I judged books in the fiction category of the annual competition of the Aviation and Space Writer's Association, and I was always stunned by a description of the heroine, naked in the shower, holding his turgid manhood...what the heck did that have to do with flying a helicopter????
Of course, maybe that is just me. But I believe everything must be in context.
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Joined: 4/30/2011
Posts: 662
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@DaveMcClure: I cannot imagine reading so many stories that put in a scene like that. I think I would give up after the first year. I had a friend that wrote fiction the same way. I just can't read her stuff anymore. Scenes like that are supposed to sensationalize the writing, and it is unfortunate that many think that is needed to make it good. It reminds me of the counselor from Ten Things I Hate About You who is writing the bosom ripper. "I'll let you get back to Reginald's quivering member."
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Joined: 3/13/2011
Posts: 412
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I really don't have any. I have no interest in writing stories based around certain things, for example, I don't think I could have written the plot for the Unbeliever series, as a main character who rapes is not something I would want to write. But.... if it came up as I was plotting the story, and it happened in the story, and works in the story... I'd put it in.
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Joined: 2/27/2011
Posts: 353
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Bumping this thread up!
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Joined: 3/13/2011
Posts: 412
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I seem to have killed so many threads here...
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Joined: 2/27/2011
Posts: 353
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LOL LOL LOL!
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Joined: 6/14/2012
Posts: 194
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I won't do graphic POV of a sadist. If there's a reason to get into the sadist's POV, I'll stay there as briefly as possible, and get out...having that mindset in my head hurts. There are genres and subgenres I'll never write in, because I don't want to go there--I don't want to deal with characters who are sadistic, who are sociopaths, etc. Met some in real life, do not want to spend a year with them in my head, writing them. If genres that require that level of darkness, they're not for me.
For the rest--it's how, and for what purpose, the dark stuff is shown that matters to me, as both reader and writer. I think that's a line that every writer draws for himself or herself--and that readers draw when they drop a book in the trash.
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Joined: 4/22/2012
Posts: 175
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One of my favorite graphic novels is Johnny the Homicidal Maniac, by Jhonen Vasquez (the same guy who created Invader Zim, the Nickelodeon cartoon), and there's a line in the foreward of his book that really speaks to me on the matter of writing into the darkness: "There's a little monster inside all of us, a little wolf-faced monkey that needs to be satiated." The author of the foreward goes on to say, "As humans we are taught to forget that we are animals. Animals kill to survive, and it's just as natural for us. To deny nature is to deny life. Now that you've committed murder in your dream world, relax. Take a deep breath, give your monster a high five and put him away. You've just used an evil fantasy to keep you civilized and sane."
So, I'd have to say that I'm with Ghost on this one. I don't have boundaries with my characters, and in fact, I like to write out dark/graphic/sadistic scenes sometimes just for the challenge - you have to put yourself in a completely different place and be able to make it real, even if you can't really see what you're writing because you're flinching the entire time. Strain has several very dark scenes, and honestly, my only beef with them right now is how well they're done.
That said, since I write romance, I will (likely) never kill off a main character. I will torture them in every conceivable way, if the plot calls for it, but they'll be alive to see a new day at the end of it all.
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Joined: 4/30/2011
Posts: 662
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As I continue to write, I've come to realize that I have many sadistic, sociopathic characters who are more concerned about themselves than anything else.
That said, I have characters who worry about others and are trying to do the right thing. I don't have boundaries of where I go, but I try to strike a balance. The reader needs a moment to know that I, the writer, knows that good people do exist somewhere. Drama and darkness all the time gets tiresome. We need to smile every once in a while.
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Joined: 1/9/2012
Posts: 22
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I have a point that I will not read or write beyond - graphic child or animal abuse are cases in point.
I think the reader can be shown that something terrible has happened without having his or her nose rubbed in every gory, gritty detail. What will stop me dead is the author who seems to be enjoying the really bad scenes.
It can also be more frightening/ upsetting if some details are left to the imagination. Not everyone is upset or frightened by the same things, but they will imagine their worst nightmare if given the opportunity.
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Joined: 5/28/2012
Posts: 43
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It's animal abuse for me. I think because I have a lot of pets and I take better care of them than I do of myself. Child abuse, well, I'm unlikely to encounter that in my work because there aren't very many children who are characters in my manuscripts, and the ones who are there need to make it to adulthood intact.
I tend to think I probably wouldn't write about child abuse, just because when I see others writing about it, it's often (not always) a short cut to make the abuser seem like a one-dimensional BAD GUY. I think there can be better, more artful ways of doing that. Though sometimes I suppose the existence of an abuser can be necessary to a story, even an otherwise uplifting story -- think of the man who gets ahold of the boys at one point in the movie Slumdog Millionaire; their experiences with him shape their future paths in a big way.
I don't mind foul language, I tend to use it myself in everyday life (context-appropriate, of course -- I used it in my graduate lab along with other students, but I won't in my new job that starts tomorrow). Although it should have a purpose; it shouldn't be used just for shock value. I don't mind writing or reading sex but I don't go into a lot of detail when I write it.
Like an earlier poster in the thread, I get tired of female characters who are raped and then die or commit suicide.
I have written from the POV of a sadist, but not while he is carrying out sadistic acts. There is a reason, related to my narrative choices, that I don't write many scenes from the POV of the "bad guys." I didn't do it to deliberately avoid getting into the heads of sadists, though. (Not all of my antagonists are sadists, at any rate.)
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Joined: 3/17/2011
Posts: 88
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Hey folks,
As a survivor of childhood sexual abuse I kinda have an opposite experience from a lot of people. If I'm to write about rape or sadism I feel obliged to show it. Give folks the benefit of my experience (the importance of turning the evil we've been through into something useful or valuable is a big part of the healing process). To make it unequivocal and real. Keeping it all off stage or sidestepping it in any way would be to perpetuate an attitude in society that is really part of the problem.
Our society still indulges in so much denial about these subjects--it doesn't happen to nice people, or rich people, or whatever "our" kind of people are. Or it just doesn't happen, period, at least not very often at all, right?
And if it does happen, the "polite" thing to do is to pretend it doesn't happen! (That one drives me up a wall.) It's an awful thing for people who have been through this kind of evil to have well intentioned folk pretend nothing happened out of "kindness." The unfortunate and surely unintended message that sends to survivors is that these kindly folks would really rather we didn't exist.
So, for me, if you're gonna write about rape or sadism or child abuse, then do so as thoroughly and as truthfully and as fearlessly as you can. Don't make it a mere plot device. And if you're doing it all just to titilate, we'll know and we'll kinda despise you for it. And we'll tell all our friends to stay away (Memoirs of a Geisha, I'm lookin' at you).
Sorry to come off so harsh and heavy about this stuff, but it's some pretty harsh and heavy territory we're discussing, no? People like me actually seek out books on these subjects, so if you're writing about rape and abuse, you might want to keep such readers in mind. We're your demographic. 
-Kevin
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Joined: 6/28/2011
Posts: 188
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Terrific response, Kevin. I don't think you came off too harsh or heavy at all. Thanks very much for having the courage to share your background and provide a real-world context.
As for my line, it is never about a specific immutable taboo, but rather about what the particular character can bear. I'm not really interested in writing stories about people who end up broken by their experiences, so I'm generally not going to subject any major character to an experience that's beyond their capacity to endure, absorb, and grow out of.
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Joined: 4/27/2011
Posts: 608
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@Kevin: That was a very brave, insightful and thought-provoking response. I am so glad you spoke up and contributed to the discussion. Every word of that short missive resonates with life-learned wisdom, personal pain and morally-grounded analytical criticism.
You and I go at it hammer-and-tongs sometimes, eh? But not today, sir. No. Not today.
I am humbled and rather awed by your writing there.
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Joined: 4/30/2011
Posts: 662
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@Kevin: Thank you for the insight. There be truth in your words. You're correct in saying that the "out of sight, out of mind" mentality is part of the problem. I'm happy that you were willing to share that with us as a person who has been through such an experience.
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@ herb said I'm not really interested in writing stories about people who end
up broken by their experiences, so I'm generally not going to subject
any major character to an experience that's beyond their capacity to
endure, absorb, and grow out of.
I tend to write about people who are already broken and are looking for ways to heal. And if they can't heal - because some things you just won't/can't heal from - then finding the sanest ways possible to "cope" (i hate that word).
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Joined: 6/14/2012
Posts: 194
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At different times in my life, I've handled harsh topics differently. But like Kevin, I don't think you can plaster over violence and make it pretty/smooth/just in the background, or use it carelessly, without harm. To you and to the reader. If it's just about making the villain obviously a bad guy, or making the protag obviously a good guy...then that's cheapening it. Cheap grace is not grace at all.
There's a relatively new writer, Stina Liecht, whose book Of Blood and Honey is an excellent example of how to do it right (as is the sequel Blue Skies from Pain, which I got to read before it came out, lucky me!) The books are hard to read--hard to admit such things happen (prison rape, for instance) and there is not one hint of porn to it--it's raw, it's terrible, she writes the emotional ruin of it (and other things) brilliantly. (It's set in Northern Ireland during the Troubles.)
I've written about child rape from the POV of the adult whose family lied to her, told her it was just dreams during a fever, and who finds out later, by accident, that it not only happened, but was a family friend. It explains a lot about her--what's happened throughout her life so far, why people react to her as they do--and finding out the truth starts a whole new set of problems and possibilities for her.
The thing is...consequences. All these things--assaults, abuse, rape, torture, killing--have consequences for both victim and perpetrator, and for anyone in the chain of causation. For me, it's essential that the consequences be part of the story--an important part of the story. Even when killing is sanctioned (as a soldier in combat) it has consequences for the one who kills.
(I suppose it's worth mentioning that most of my female POV characters did not have an abusive childhood and were not raped as children--they can get into enough trouble as adults without that. I'm as negative about always using childhood suffering as a springboard to a heroic adult life as I am about using rape or torture to show just how nasty the villain is.)
Because I write military SF and epic fantasy with a lot of military action in it, there's going to be violence--but it has to mean something, not just be something to move the plot along. We joke about throwing a grenade through the door, or dropping a team of ninjas through the ceiling when we're stuck....but if it's done just to relieve tedium, it's not worth it. When I look back over all the books, there's a lot of violence--natural to the kind of story--from an infant accidentally killed during the storming of a city, to a man dying of an infected gut wound, to torture and rape and beatings. But it was always more than a plot point.
There are things I haven't written, but I don't know if some story will call for them or not. I don't like writing from the bad guy's point of view if the bad guy is a sociopath--writing from POV means having the person inside my head and it's not a good feeling. At all. I have written from the POV of rotten politicians, dishonest schemers of various types--don't like it, but sometimes have to do it so readers can understand what's going on. There were two "bad" POVs in one book that I actually admired...men whose culture was so different from the main one I wrote about that they were perfectly moral and honorable there--but not "here." (One was the head of state; the other was an assassin. The head of state, if he ordered the assassination of another head of state, was--by their law--then executed. He thought it was worth it.)
So I can't say for sure what I won't write. I'll write what the story demands, and handle it the way my personal conscience insists on.
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Joined: 10/14/2012
Posts: 229
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I think my line in fiction would be as many have mentioned before, descriptive writing of an act of child abuse. I'd find it difficult to write and also be worried in case adding to the exposure of such activities may somehow normalise it; and making it available to the general populace where any sicko can read it or be influenced by it,.... well you get the picture.
I've never had to face this dilema though.
Where I have endured a difficult time is when the violence and horrendous activities are perpetrated by the character whose POV I am writing from. Then as it's his/her POV, it has to be justified in their mind, and therefore in my writing perspective.... does that make sense?
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Joined: 1/21/2013
Posts: 3
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Wow lots of good answers - some I agree with and others I understand. Part of it is knowing your audience. Part of it is understanding yourself - what you are trying to create. For me nothing is off limits, as long as it edifies a story. Everything is a tool and yes some are more difficult to use than others. I've used murder (adults and children), torture, rape, decapitation, bestiality (yes that), sex, and all sorts of inappropriate things to tell a story. Hopefully I've never used any of these when not needed and they don't appear in everything I write.
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Joined: 4/4/2013
Posts: 18
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My characters, even antagonists, do not kill puppies or kitties. Children, sure. But NOT puppies. Not even cats or dogs.
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Joined: 6/5/2013
Posts: 7
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What lines won't i cross? well i think rape is one that is difficult to read and difficult to write, i think i could write a story in which a rape occurs in the character's past, and maybe i could have a few flashes of the experience but i don't know if i could ever bring myself to write a full and detailed rape scene.
sex scenes in general would hold the potential to make me very, very uncomfortable. but, i do think i could write one because if it doesn't make me uncomfortable i will probably see it as funny in some way.
i can easily write characters with all sorts of horrors in their pasts but i think it would be truly hard to write a good death scene for a character i care about.
I think it is also good to share how far I AM willing to push the envelope. i have a character falling for a slightly older woman with a child, he is a teenager. i am also planning for some disturbing content in my book. i will not divulge that but i will say that i have thought about a character doing human experimentation on on various ages of people including the unborn.
i think a little darkness is necessary, even in a light book, otherwise what light that is in the book seems meaningless.
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I swear in my head...a lot...so I have to pull back the reins when I write. I'm not a potty mouth. I get scolded for being unladylike by my family and boyfriend if I say the F word, oh dear lord not the F word!...probably why my characters swear, to get it all out of my system.
Okay, so I watch the swearing. Too much is annoying really. Just enough (House of Night's Aphrodite, great swearer).
I will not go anywhere near child abuse. Seems like that is a popular response here and I agree. I know writers are supposed to write with no restraints, and to record the human experiences, the good and the bad, but I don't think anybody really wants to read about child abuse, and I don't want to write about it.
Other than that, I will beat the shit out of my characters without blinking...yes, it hurts my heart, but I know they are going to be okay...well, unless I kill them later, but, they will have an epic death that means something. That is something else, meaningless killing (...unless the villain is a murdering sociopath, in which case its essential).
I don't mind being violent. Cutting fingers off one by one, then ripping the skin off a character and hanging it out to dry on the roof is all fine with me, but I shy away from intense sexual abuse and humiliation. If it is necessary to a character's backstory, then I might make it known, but will not describe it in detail. For example, I have a character who was abused by her father. She has scars on her back. I show the scars, inject her emotions and reactions to certain situations that hint at a connection to her past, so we see the effect on her, but I won't take her there and show it to the reader.
Oh geesh, rape? I don't know. I just haven't had a story in which a character was raped, so I can't say for sure I'd never go there. I know I don't feel comfortable with it.
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