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Joined: 3/11/2011
Posts: 156
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With the growing membership on the site, I'd love to be able to find and connect with some of the erotic romance writers out there. I'm currently writing for Liquid Silver Book and I'm editing for Phaze (as well as the Awe-Struck non-erotic line). But who else is writing or interested in Erotic Romance?
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Joined: 3/12/2011
Posts: 40
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I write an erotic series and I'm having a ton of fun with it. I didn't post it here though because it gets explicit early and I wasn't sure how that would be received. I love being released from the HEA ending requirement of the romance genre. I wrote it with a cliffhanger ending, with the second book picking up shortly after the first ends. I think it makes it hard to sell though to an agent, romance is big, but HEA is a part of that and publishers don't want to be forced into a series, which a cliffhanger ending does. I'm rethinking it, but I don't like it.
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Joined: 3/12/2011
Posts: 376
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I've got a (surprise) mixed genre series out. There *are* HEA or HFN, as well as some erotic content, plus action / adventure and paranormal elements.
Some publishers LOVE series. I'm published through Decadent, and if they like the series, they're all for making it a series.
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Joined: 3/16/2011
Posts: 214
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Can I ask a dumb question? What constitutes erotic fiction, exactly? Is there a specific formula for this? I mean, I've heard of it before, but pointing me to some examples would be helpful so I can get a feel for this genre.
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Joined: 3/13/2011
Posts: 412
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I'm curious as well. Is it quantity of sex? Because it can't be explicitness, unless harlequinn is considered erotic romance.
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Joined: 3/13/2011
Posts: 102
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I read erotic romance but have not yet attempted to write anything longer than a short story in this genre. My favourite author of this type of fiction is Opal Carew.
For me what defines erotic romance is the focus on exploring fantasy (i.e. the relationship between the characters is important but almost secondary) combined with explicit sex scenes.
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Joined: 3/11/2011
Posts: 156
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Oh, responses and questions. Okay, I'll try to define things a bit.
Erotica / Literary Erotica / Erotic fiction -- this can be any form of fiction that uses sex and sexual relationship as a means to tell a good story. The characters in the story may or may not have a romantic relationship, but there is a plot. Literary erotica may go deeper and use sex as a means to explore society or the human condition.
Romance / Erotic Romance - yes, these two go together. These are stories where the plot is driven by the romance between the characters. Yes, the romance/relationship between the characters is key to the story. Both require HEA, though erotic romance can also have an HFN. (Happily Ever After and Happily for Now.) Romance novels can range from the sweet (only kissing, no sex, often ends with a wedding) to spicy (may have some sex) to erotic (explicit sexual descriptions).
Harlequin - yes, some of their lines are erotic romance. I think they've actually stopped hiding that on their writer guidelines. But they do tend to be more "vanilla" when it comes to the sex and romance equation so most stories will be a monogamous relationship with a M/F pair.
Sex and the erotic romance. What makes a story an erotic romance and not just erotica in general is that a romantic relationship drives the story. The amount of sex and even the level of sexual explicitness can vary, but the sex should work as a way of showing and exploring the relationship between the characters. A full length erotic romance may only have a handful of sex scenes. One of mine that is getting 4 star reviews only has 3 actual sex scenes involving both MCs.
Erotic romance short stories - this is an area where some publish will drop the HEA or HFN requirement. These really can be one long sexual fantasy. Some publisher will only consider short stories from in-house authors, which means you have to place a novella or novel with them before you can write short stories for them. Or submit to a call for an anthology.
Formulas - none except that the story should explore the romantic relationship between the characters and should have a HEA or HFN. Actually, it's a good idea to get the whole formula concept out of your mind for romance these days. Oh, there are requirements like an HEA, but that's no more a formula than mystery writers having to reveal the murderer at the end.
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Joined: 3/13/2011
Posts: 412
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So, erotic romance is just, erotica with a storyline and a happy ending (no pun intended)
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Joined: 3/11/2011
Posts: 156
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Well, it could be. But it's more accurate to think of it as romance with the sex parts included. It's actually a shorter jump from a modern "spicy" romance to erotic romance than it is from erotica to an erotic romance. If you regularly write erotica, you'd want to look at some romance novels and erotic romance novels to get an idea of what publishers look for. However, there are plenty of small presses out there for erotic romance and what doesn't appeal to one may very well sell to another.
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Joined: 3/15/2011
Posts: 10
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I've written a bunch erotic romance of different types m/f, m/m/ and menage for a few different publishers. The characters pretty much decide how steamy a particular story will be. I've been surprised a few times, when stories I thought would have more erotic content ended up with only one or two full love scenes.
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Joined: 3/16/2011
Posts: 214
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How do you know what you've written?
My contemporary is very character-driven, and the primary emphasis is on the relationship between the m/f. And of course, it has a HEA. No white wedding or anything like that, but the characters do end up together, and there's a strong hint that it's for life. The sex scenes, of which there are three, are pretty erotic. Think early Linda Howard.
So now I'm scratching my head, wondering if I should redefine this.
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Joined: 3/14/2011
Posts: 5
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I LOVE writing erotic romance. I always hated romance books that gave you this great in-depth emotional story then some really suck ass purple prose laden crap that made you wonder if you were reading a book by someone with a flower fetish with all the dewy petals and tight rosebud references. 
I've found my erotic romance publishers are much more open to cutting edge stories that don't fit neatly into one genre. It's really nice to just be able to let my muse do her thing without worry about there being too much darkness for this type of romance or not enough sweetness for that type of romance. Erotic romance is about well written stories that take the tug at the heart strings and the readers desires. I can label my book as Romantic Urban Fantasy and they accept that because it is what it is.
I believe horror and erotica romance are two of the hardest genres to write. Each should be able to make an actual physical and psychological reaction happen in the reader. In Horror's case, you have to make your reader feel scared. In Erotica's case, aroused. Each are complex biological reactions that produce changes in the readers body. And each won't happen if you can't engage the readers mind so thoroughly into the story that they immerse themselves and feel what the character feels.
Crappy writing is not going to make your readers heart race and their emotions fire up. That's not to say what appeals to one person is going to appeal to another. For example, I personally love alpha male D/s stories, but another reader may hate D/s. That's why you see so much variety in the field of erotica and why I love it so much.
Oh, and like the original poster I'm currently writing for Liquid Silver Books, as well as Loose Id and Decadent Publishing. Some of what I write is smoking hot, some of what I write is a little sweeter, but it's all erotic 
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Joined: 3/30/2011
Posts: 6
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Whut up Marie? Thanks for turning me onto this site! I love it!!
Sherry
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Joined: 3/11/2011
Posts: 156
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Yay! You made it in to the Betafish pond!
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Joined: 3/30/2011
Posts: 6
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So Marie, we gonna start an erotica queue or what? I wish we could private message people here. I've some things to tell ya. Not life ending or anything so it can wait until they set that up.
Anyway, back to the topic. I started writing because I was tired of spending money on books with a bang up story that kept me turning the page with hot steamy making out then bam it’s the next day. Or, the story sucked, and I couldn’t even get to the sex. I had no idea how much fun it is to create a world with people living their life, and I think I’m getting pretty good at it. At least my critiques aren’t filled with as much “red ink” as they used to be.
I find it hard to believe that everyone doesn’t want a little romance in a story. If it has people/or whatever in it, someone will feel hot for someone. It’s real life. I only write M/F, but I’ll critique anything with sex. Bring on the fetish I say, it may make ME shudder, but I can appreciate how someone else may find it hot.
So, my fellow BookCountry peeps, are we going to ask for a sub-genre for erotica?
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Joined: 3/16/2011
Posts: 214
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@Sherry
I’ve noticed the same thing about sex scenes, too. Feast or famine. Good story line, very little sex. Alternately, a lot of sex (sometimes decently written, sometimes not) and a negligible storyline. Rarely do I read a romance that incorporates both very well, which is why I took great care to focus on both story and the fun stuff.
What I cannot personally stand is when the sex scenes come across like something in a porn flick. I can practically hear the chika-chika-mow playing in the background …
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Joined: 3/30/2011
Posts: 6
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@LisaMaire - Right. I don't mind so much if it's bow-chika-bow-wow if it's contemporary. Historical, if the heroine is a virgin raised in a society driven home, no way. As far as I’m concerned the taking of a sheltered virgin to a bow-chika-bow-wow is the most important part. It has to be done just right. But, I’m all about the tease. Lots and lots of tease.
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Joined: 3/11/2011
Posts: 156
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Since the site is only open to those over 18, I think erotic romance can be submitted for crit under the romance genre, then classified as "sexy."
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Joined: 2/27/2011
Posts: 11
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I'm another published erotic romance and erotica author. I tend towards the more vanilla end of erotic fiction. The story I have posted here, though, is not erotic, more PG-13 because that's how the story came out  I'm finding I prefer writing shorter when I write erotic, so I'm also leaning more toward the erotica end of the spectrum rather than erotic romance. I've got a couple of stories floating around in my head that I plan on writing later this year.
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Wow. Great discussion! I'm in agreement that the main difference between the two is the significance of the sex, though I would also say that how graphic the sex is is also important. Sure, some romance novels do have graphic sex scenes, but they don't stretch out for as long as they typically do in erotic romance, at least in my experience. It's obviously a highly subjective area, so it's a difficult one to define. When I'm to determine between romance and ER or erotica I usually ask myself a series of questions:
How integral is sex to the story? Would the story survive without it?
How graphic is the sex? How frequent?
Which is more significant to the work--lust or love?
Etc.
I also really like the mention people have made to ER being more fantasy based. That's very important and a great point to make!
As for Book Country, we do not have a separate section for Erotic Romance, as you can see. Perhaps in the future we will consider it if the community has proven it an important distinction for the purposes of the site, but for now, we're going to stick with what we've got
You can, of course, upload your ER stories to the site though! As Marie says, just put it in the appropriate romance subgenre and mark your primary tone as "sexy." In addition we ask that you ALWAYS tag works that fall into categories where there is extreme/graphic sex or violence as such so that your readers know what to expect. It's the best way to make sure Book Country members are aware of what you're sharing. In fact, I'm going to look into this more on Monday--I don't remember off the top of my head if we have an "erotica" or "erotic romance" tag. But I'm thinking we should have one
Oh and @LisaMarie, if you're asking about SEE SABRINA RUN and whether or not it's romance or erotic romance, it's most definitely romance There is much focus on relationships and love in your story that exists away from the characters' sex lives. Three sex scenes can certainly take place in a contemporary romance! Even super steamy ones (or maybe even, especially hehe)!
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Joined: 3/12/2011
Posts: 376
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@Danielle - Hallo! I missed you at RT!
If there will be an Erotic Romance tag, could we also have some form of 'explicit content' tag? There are things that aren't erotic, but *are* definitely in the NC-17 category for one reason or another. Author Notes will help with that, but it might be nice to have a warning label for explicit and graphic violence or whatnot.
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Joined: 3/16/2011
Posts: 214
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@Danielle
Got the Big Three.
Writing the “steamy” was, in this case, crucial to the plot, as it seals the emotional attachment between one very aloof character and one for whom expression of physical intimacy is far more easier. Not to say that I didn’t struggle with it – gosh, was this difficult. Because I sort of turned everything on its ear. Instead of making the female protagonist willing and supplicant, I put her in the more “male” position of distancing herself from sex. (Well, at first.)
In the end, everyone’s happy. Serious HEA.
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Joined: 3/11/2011
Posts: 156
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It's probably easiest to keep erotic romance with romance in general and use a tag for any romance that the author feels is explicit. Otherwise, you'll end up with newer writers struggling to figure out whether they have a romance, spicy romance, steamy romance or erotic romance. These days there isn't always that much difference between a spicy Harlequin and some of the softer erotic romance.
Other tags that come in handy with erotic romance are
M/F - a man and woman or a "het" romance
M/M - man on man or "gay" romance (technically, the guys don't have to be gay)
F/F - female on female or lesbian romance
M/F/M - a threesome consisting of 2 men and woman. The men have sex with the woman but not with each other.
M/M/F - a threesome where the men enjoy each other and the woman
BDSM - bondage, etc.
Also, most erotic romance publisher won't accept any of the following:
Bestiality (were creatures and shifters are okay)
Pedophilia or characters under 18 in sexual situations
Necrophilia or anything close
Bodily waste products
Incest/Twincest
Serious injury, rape, or snuff portrayed in a positive light
Now must erotic romance authors don't faint if one of those crops up in a story. But they will usually advise the writer that they need to review the rules for the publishers they're thinking about submitting to.
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Joined: 3/13/2011
Posts: 412
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Well, for example, my wip , phoenix 2125, is a paranormal thriller, in my mind. But there are some erotic romance elements, and some graphic sex scenes. So that explicit content tag would serve me as well!
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Joined: 3/30/2011
Posts: 6
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I once read a book with the longest, hottest sex scene ever. When I finished reading the scene, I went back and counted 9 pages from first kiss to smoking a cigarette. 9 pages! Not one word of it boring, trite, or overused. Now that's what I want to do. But, alas... I find that after about 4 hot paragraphs, I've run out of ideas to keep the hippity dippity hot.
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Joined: 3/12/2011
Posts: 40
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I give. It's either the impatience of waiting for an erotica novel or the migraine medication but I went ahead and posted a few chapters of an erotica novel I wrote a couple years ago. I labeled it as sexy romance per Danielle and put the erotic tag on there and we'll see if I get crucified. I wish I could say it's a nine page sex scene (that'd be awesome!) but it's actually pretty short and only there for character development/reference for when the mc's hook up later. Have at it fellow betafish!
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Joined: 3/11/2011
Posts: 156
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Hey Tori, which title is it? I see 3 on your profile but I'm not sure which color is associated with sexy.
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@Robert C Roman - you saw me at RT, silly! I came over to you at the Vampire Ball all Buffy-ified haha and I saw you the next day at the signing!
Also, we have a variety of explicit tags, though they are listed as "graphic" rather than "explicit" I've confirmed too that there IS a tag for "erotica" for those who need it!
@MarieDees Sexy Romance will be purple for the main cover color and red for the secondary (the small square at the bottom right)
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Joined: 3/11/2011
Posts: 156
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Thanks. and YAY! for the erotica tag.
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Joined: 3/12/2011
Posts: 40
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The one I posted is Also Known As Lexi Frost. Talking to a beta reader who just got back to me gave me an idea how to push back the quickie so the first contact is the MCs but I don't want to disrupt that scene with a flashback no matter how brief. I still want a 9 page sex scene. Everyone needs a goal, right? Considering I don't do the whole poetic prose thing, it's going to be a challenge. That's the fun of it.
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Joined: 3/12/2011
Posts: 376
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@Tori - why 9 pages?
I'm asking because depending on where you mark the start of the 'sex scene', my latest has one that's nine pages long.
Amusingly, I've been told the book is not properly 'erotica', 'erotic romance' or 'romance'. I wasn't going for the 'erotica' tag, but I really do think it's a romance, and it's, well, got a nine page graphic sex scene between the Hero and Heroine...
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Joined: 3/11/2011
Posts: 156
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graphic sex does not a romance make.
Does the main plot line revolve around the H and H falling in love? Is the FMC* POV/Plot line at least 50% of the novel? Does it end with an HEA (Happily Ever After) based on the H and H fulfilling a relationship?
Now, if you have those, it might be a romance.
*Female Main Character - does not apply for gay romance.
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Joined: 3/12/2011
Posts: 40
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I'd just love to do a make-you-weak-in-the-knees-ultra-long-sex scene. All mine just seem over too quickly. Not wham bam thank you quickly, just could have been happy with a little more.
There are some books out there that are nothing but sex and I don't think qualify as erotic romance. As Decadent Pub put it, the sex scenes should enhance the story not be the story. I look at the series I've got going and it really strikes me more of a soap opera with the good bits left in. Yeah, there's romance, but in the long run there's as much drama as anything. That concerns me a little. Sex is in there, so it's erotica, but it's not about the sex (except for the nyphomaniac I'm about to introduce, too bad she's not going to get any for awhile. poor girl. I'm mean.) It's about the relationships, the love, the hardships, the complications keeping people apart until they finally get to be together while i go pick on someone else. Erotica doesn't require a HEA ending, although I go with a HFN.
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Joined: 3/11/2011
Posts: 156
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Keep in mind that there is a difference between Erotica and Erotic Romance. Which always seems to cause confusion.
Erotica as a genre separate from other genres doesn't even require the characters to know each other or like each other. I've read fantastic literary erotica where a female character dealt with her emotions while visiting a female prostitute in Amsterdam. The point of the story was not to bring the characters together, but to show a single character's emotional journey.
Erotic Romance is part of the romance genre and with a few exceptions, the publisher do want an HEA. (HFN generally comes in for certain lengths or subgenres. M/M can go with an HFN or a short story may only need an HFN. You'd want to see where a publisher allows it.) But publisher usually want the sex to be part of an emotional involvement between the two main characters and the main plot to follow the coming together of the two characters. They want a romance. That's what makes it erotic romance. And Erotic Romance readers hang on the same boards and review sites and Goodreads groups, so if you don't deliver on what they want, they let each other know.
I don't know if I'd want to stray too far from the expected romance aspects with a first story if it came out as erotic romance. It is possible to include erotic scenes in other genres. Sex and love can't be restricted to just Romance novels. And Decadent publishes a variety of genres. I've noticed Robert's books don't seem to be primarily classified as romance. There are plenty of cross-over readers who will enjoy the stories.
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Joined: 7/18/2011
Posts: 2
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My current WIP is more sensual than erotic romance, but I have written erotic romance before. I'm actually mid a novella that is erotic romance that I'm planning to submit to Silver Publishing-- originally it was a short story but they rejected it because of the loose ends that needed to be tied up. But I both read and write the genre!
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Joined: 10/8/2011
Posts: 15
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I hope this thread isn't too old! I have an erotica book to upload but I was afraid it wasn't allowed here. This is the first evidence it existed here.
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Joined: 3/6/2012
Posts: 2
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The first "on line" story I ever read was an Erotic fiction {WOW!} and still a WIP at the time. It was a BDSM story and I didn't think I would like it but so many people were talking about it I decided to read it just to see what all the fuss was about. Now I know! LOL
It was a series and well over 200 Chapters long (combined). I was three chapters away from the end when it was pulled off line because it had been picked up by a publisher. I nearly freaked not being able to finish it when I was that close to the end!
It's now quickly becoming the talk of every house wife in the nation and was just recently mentioned on MSNBC. Not Sure if we are allowed to mention titles of published books so I will refrain from naming the book and author until I know if it's ok to do so.
At any rate it was explicit and graphic sex scenes between a sub and her Dom but the most amazing part to me (as this was a first for me) was How well written this story was. The descriptions, the characters, the secondary characters, the relationships, the histories and most importantly (IMHO) the plot and the romance, all were part of this story. The author incorprated Music into her story as well and introduced so many readers to classical music. I know several women who have claimed this novel saved their marriage and brought their husbands closer to them!!
Just writing sex scenes for the fun of it isn't romance or even erotica, it's porn. If you don't have all the facets I mentioned above then the story wouldn't be a story at all. Since reading her book I have tried to incorporate more Erotica (and music) into my stories though I don't know if I would categorize them as erotic romances.
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Joined: 3/12/2012
Posts: 8
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I also write sexy, erotic novels for Siren. I had six published last year, but I want to concentrate on my romantic thrillers here under my name..
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Joined: 3/13/2011
Posts: 412
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Would the online novel be Tales of Mu?
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Joined: 3/10/2011
Posts: 21
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I write erotic romance. M/M erotic romance mostly, but I have done a few short stories that were M/F. I'm not published as of yet, but when I do so, I'd like it to be m/m erotic romance, contemporary and/or paranormal.
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Joined: 4/22/2012
Posts: 175
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M/M erotic romance writer here! I just started writing in this genre out loud (as in, anyone close to me knows now that this is what I write), but I've been writing it "in the closet" for a long time - longer than I even realized, when I started looking back through my old stuff. I'm excited to get feedback on how I'm doing!
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Joined: 8/20/2012
Posts: 10
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Hi Marie, I write Erotic Romance, I too am wanting to connect with other writers in the same genre. I was confused as first on the erotica/romance issue. Someone called me ms porn which really got to me, sex does not even take place until 3/4 of the way through lol. Hoping to get some feedback as this is my first novel.
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Joined: 3/14/2011
Posts: 226
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I've tried my hand at several sub-genres of romance, including historical and paranormal. But I write erotic romance, too...and will be putting my latest novella up here soon. In the meantime, I'm reading other people's.
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Joined: 2/9/2012
Posts: 427
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This thought-provoking article about 50 Shades of Grey and erotic romance came on my radar last week, and I wanted to share it with you guys. The writer tries to distinguish between romance, erotic romance and erotica based on the amount of sexual content in books. There are actually graphical representations of the sexual content of 50 Shades, scene-by-scene! The point of the article is that the more mainstream 50 Shades has become, the more it is considered "contemporary romance" rather than "erotic romance." So, then, is 50 Shades making romance as a genre more steamy? http://www.digitalbookworld.com/2013/did-fifty-shades-of-grey-shift-the-line-between-romance-and-erotica/
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Joined: 1/10/2012
Posts: 192
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Nevena - I have personal issues with the publication of that book (see my thread on Straddling the line between plagiarism and inspiration), but I wanted to weigh in here. Personally, I don't think 50 has blazed any trails in terms of erotic literature, though it seems the public is giving it much more credit than I think it deserves. I've read other, much more erotic, books that curl my toes and provide me with something to shoot for in the sex scenes that I write. Those other books are also much better written and have a plot that works.
I'm not sure if what I'm writing right now will become erotic romance or something else. Right now, everything is up for debate with my book, it seems!
But sex, like so much else, is so subjective and personal to the reader. I guess no matter what each of us considers vanilla or four-alarm-fire spicy, we should read lots of good sex (haha!) and strive to create a scene that stirs our readers as much as the stuff we've read has. Right?
Not sure if this makes any sense. I'm exhausted and thinking about sex... haha. And those books I love.
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Joined: 3/14/2011
Posts: 226
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I think romance in general has become more steamy over the years. Whether a book is "erotic" romance versus "steamy" romance is one of those debates that are like "urban fantasy versus paranormal romance." There's a line, but it's fuzzy. I can't remember where I saw the distinction made, but I've always liked the idea that "erotic romance" is romance in which the sex is *required* for the character arcs. In other words, remove the sex, and the relationship/story doesn't work. Many BDSM stories rely on the vulnerability in sex to shift a character's mindset and arc. My erotic romance is based on the character's water fetish and how she learns to see it as less "weird" and more as a part of her. The sexuality of the characters help DRIVE the arc.
I'll admit to not reading 50 Shades. I've read enough excerpts to know I would have a hard time getting through all of it. I like how it's helped erotic romance become more mainstream, but I *do* think it's getting way too much credit in the media. There are other authors out there who've been around for years who deserve some recognition. After all, publishers like Loose Id and Ellora's Cave didn't spring up in the last year--they've been lucrative for years because we like what they produce.
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Joined: 4/25/2013
Posts: 17
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I'm currently in the process of trying my hand at something I'm dubbing Hardcore Romance. Not purely sex, but not just lovey dovey either.
Specifically, I'd like to produce a story with a 50 Shades vibe with actual strong characters.
The story I'm currently editing, and will submit on this site shortly, leans more towards the steamy romance. Fans are most likely needed ... or so I'm told.
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