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Joined: 2/9/2012 Posts: 427
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Please help us make Book Country better and let us know what type of changes, improvements and new features you want to see in the new iteration of Book Country that will launch in the summer! (Now is the time to ask for the stars.)
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Joined: 8/13/2011 Posts: 272
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Two suggestions:
1) A 'In Need Of Love' link to books that haven't been reviewed a lot. It often seems that the only books I notice are the ones that have been recently updated, newly uploaded or somehow floated to the top of the Buzz and Favourites section. I've no idea how to implement it, but something to do with active users and their un-updated books.
2) Inter-personal messaging. I'm sure this gets asked for a lot, but it'd be nice to be able to directly poke/ talk to people without having to rely on the indirect communication of Discussions and Comments. Knowing the internet, it might not be a bad idea to have this as an opt-in mechanic.
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Joined: 4/27/2011 Posts: 608
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1.) I'd like to be able to see all of my followed discussions in an "exploded view" list w/o scrolling two-by-two through all 82 of them. (Same for followed books.)
2.) I'd appreciate a spell-checker within the "typing window" I could activate before hitting "post". Ditto a "preview" feature (to check line spacing, bold and italics, etc.)
3.) I want to be able to read a writer's story "full-screen", not cramped into that $@#! one-long-paragraph-at-a-time interface window.
4.) I'd like the option to tell a writer: "I would buy this now and pay x $$ for your book. Let me know when you publish it on the site." And then I'd like to be alerted when they do so.
5.) I want reviews to remain on-line and credited to working reviewers even if the associated stories/novels associated with the reviews themselves disappear. (I enjoy reading reviews--call me weird!--as it gives me a sense of the reviewer's personal aesthetic sensibility, experience, literary judgement and language skills.)
6.) I would like Book Country to run on-site contests for member writers only from time-to-time, complete with rewards. $100 for the best short story about ____ or in genre ____; $50 Amazon.com gift certificate to the writer who pens the most clueless review of a famous novel, etc. That kind of thing.
7.) I'd like these RESPOND windows to be bigger and show more text.
8.) I'd like a ten-minute window after hitting "post" to fix typos I missed the first time, even if someone else has just posted under me.
9.) I'd like to see more genres included. (Poetry, anyone? Anyone . . . ?)
10.) I'd like to see this Book Country site last a hundred years and become the hottest, "must-go-to" on-line site for working agents, editors and writers.
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Joined: 2/9/2012 Posts: 427
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@Tim, there will be private messaging... =) I agree that "In Need of Love" books should be more prominent. We'll work on that.
@Carl: I'd like to see this Book Country site last a hundred years and become the hottest, "must-go-to" on-line site for working agents, editors and writers." I'd like that, too. =)
Both of you, thank you for taking the time to write down these thoughts; we want the site to be very user-friendly and easy to use, so real users' experience is super helpful to us.
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Joined: 6/7/2011 Posts: 467
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Preach it, Mister Reed!
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Joined: 10/20/2011 Posts: 350
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1. While I put "The Conference House" under "historical romances," I consider it more historical fiction than romance. So I would love to have "historical fiction" as a main genre rather than a subgenre.
2. I second a private messaging option.
3. I know I can't be the only one who spends a lot of time on reviews and review replies. So I wouldn't mind having a "save draft" option for reviews and replies.
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Joined: 11/17/2011 Posts: 1016
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I would love direct messaging. More categories, that goes without saying. I don’t know if it’s possible, but is there a way to include illustrated books? How about a permanent thread dedicated to promos, our best shot at luring readers? I don’t shop for a read by category. I make my to-do list on the basis of the authors’ voices in the discussions.
Some type of ganged dust jacket copy / best bit would be helpful and, potentially, very entertaining in and of itself. Rummage through it, as with a box of chocolates, do you snag the cherry-center or the chewy nougat (which I don't care for)? If you can't shine here, that doesn't speak well of the whole. A bulletin board: barter services, advertise for dedicated critique partners, arrange regional meet-ups, any number of things. Chat rooms, date and topic announced here: Publishing professional Q&A, an hour of chat with so-and-so of such-and-such agency, questions submitted in advance for Brandi and company to sort through and choose from, additional impromptu discussion. Can that horizontal scroll for reads be changed to a vertical one, so we are not having to bump the type size up or down in order to make every line readable?
A whole page of boxed newly-posted discussions. You see immediately what's up, and are able to add to your follows. Easy-easy-easy.
Book Country coffee cups. Bumper stickers. Maybe even T-shirts.
I found out about Book Country through a mention on Salon, I think it was. Or Daily Beast. I've not seen it written up anywhere else that wasn't a specialized writer/publishing site.
Get the word out to the general public. I bet there are many who would be interested. Put us to work as walking, talking billboards. I would be delighted to recommend you. This is a start. I’m sure I’ll have more.
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WoW there are some great ideas already posted! Inter-personal messaging, Book Country Contests, Saved Draft option for reviews & comments, Book Country T-shirts -I want it all!
How about keeping this door open? Maybe, a permanent "Suggestion Box" thread where the posts get sent directly to you, Nevena. You can scan the posts & pass on what seems feasable. At the very least, it will keep you aware of what the users are thinking about the web site.
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Joined: 6/28/2011 Posts: 188
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I'd really, really, really like for discussions that I'm following to open up on the last page, not the first page, when I click into them.
I'd also like to be able to select "latest post" in a thread from the category menu, rather than having to click into the thread first and then select the last page.
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Joined: 6/18/2012 Posts: 228
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These are great, please keep the coming!
I mentioned we're in development right now, yes? I just saw the first demo for the private messaging features... It's coming, and it's cool...
There are a lot of awesome ideas here, and I'll keep you posted as we build.
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Joined: 10/13/2012 Posts: 1
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I read through all the thoughtful suggestions for improvement given above and I second each of them. Carl Reed has through his carefully enunciated ten wishes echoed all our deep desires. I wonder whether it is my network or browser problem but I find difficulty in logging out smoothly.
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Joined: 1/10/2012 Posts: 192
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Yes, I agree with all of these, and luckily everyone else mentioned (quite passionately, too) all of my would-be suggestions, so for now I shall remain quiet except to say, "Hear hear!" Can't wait to see all of the new bells and whistles!
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Joined: 2/22/2013 Posts: 5
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OK I've read through the previous ideas on this thread and some don't mean anything to me yet. I do agree with Carl Reed about full screen reads with one proviso. It's really handy having the windows for the review comments on the side. This is especially necessary because we can't download and read at our leisure. Without those windows we'd have to hop back and forward between a notepad or somesuch if we're to provide a proper crit.
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Joined: 6/7/2011 Posts: 467
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There are so many good ideas here. My biggest complaint is with the review boxes themselves. I'd just like a less cumbersome format. ("At 13% you write: Her stair was a blank screen where anything could've been written." Did you mean "stare"?) Really, my own comments are often lengthy and involve extensive, pushy suggestions for how to rewrite offending passages. It would be great for me to have bigger windows, cut and paste, even direct editing of the text itself. I realize this might be a problem in terms of the author maintaining control of who can download and copy their text and then do god knows what with it but I think it's a small risk.
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Joined: 6/18/2012 Posts: 228
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The small reviewing boxes have been lamented by the Book Country staff. We're working on a fix. I'll keep you posted.
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Joined: 2/21/2013 Posts: 40
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The Books section doesn't allow you to go to a category (Romance SF etc) by clicking the arrow next to the title. And when you go to a category the other way (by clicking the + button) there is only one line of books with no way to find more.
And, my book Wall of Dust was supposedly made a Buzz Book this morning, but has not appeared as such in the Political Thriller category. That category is the only one that fir, but really it should be in "Literary" or "Literary Thriller," neither of which category exists.
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Joined: 4/27/2011 Posts: 608
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Another request: an "update all" button which would allow BC members (via one simple, verified click: Are you sure? Yes/No) to clear out all of the update info which appears on Connected To/Followed writers and their posted works. If you have to do this individually, one writer/writing at a time it can be a time-consuming, tedious chore that requires the active BC member to make hundreds of clicks.
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Joined: 8/13/2011 Posts: 272
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Agreed with Carl. Either that or the ability to filter somehow.
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Joined: 2/9/2012 Posts: 427
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Carl and Timothy, good point, and this functionality will most likely have a completely different feel in the new Book Country.
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Joined: 2/22/2013 Posts: 5
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Being new to the site is quite confusing - what do the numbers next to books and profile pics mean? Are they rankings or what? Similarly, there are little colour blocks that differ from the title colour on each book cover - what do those mean?
As for the badges - they seem to be meaningless and again a considerable effort is needed to find the definitions.
What would be useful is some sort of ranking of reviewers - after all what are we doing here? As I see it, we all want peer reviews - don't we? I have reviewed several books and have had no reciprocal reviews at all. Maybe a writer's ranking should be dependent on whether or not they return the favour.
Perhaps a popup box of definition when the mouse is hovered over each of the above??
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Joined: 10/20/2011 Posts: 350
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The numbers aren't rankings, Charles. Those are the amount of updates regarding that book (new draft posted, a new review, a new comment) or that author (posted in a discussion, updated a book, etc.)
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Joined: 2/21/2013 Posts: 40
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I like the way BookCountry structures reviews. It is far superior (and more serious in think) to what I have seen on other sites such as Authonomy and Goodreads. But I think it would be good to add something more in order to evaluate the quality of writing in a quantitative way, so a ranking list could be generated for each category to give the star system a bit more depth. It's a type of ranking, to be sure, but nuanced enough to give credit for things like writing style literary merit, excitement etc. Each category would likely have a slightly different list. readers could consult this list as a first step and then read reviews. I thin off it as a time saver and, inevitably, one that directs people toward the best books. This ranking system would also give writers concrete areas where they need to improve. My feeling is that writing skill is not being highlighted enough (again, on other sites more than BookCountry)--too many reviews are amateurish, or just puffery in exchange for a positive review of their own book-- and so serious readers have to slog through title after title in order to find anything good. there are simply too many titles out there for that sort of trial and error approach to work.
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Joined: 6/7/2011 Posts: 467
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This is incredibly trivial but the way of assigning categories has always bugged me a little. I mean "Light with a hint of realistic." What on earth does that mean? "Dark with a hint of sexy"? Alright, I do know what it's supposed to mean, but it just sounds kind of dumb. It sounds like were describing sentient coffee drinks.
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Rofl Athys It might be, that the genre descriptions are used beyond this site. For example, a publisher might tell staff to find "n" number of books to publish of a specific genre. These genre descriptions might be common descriptions used to find stories to publish. Don't know, but I believe I read that somewhere. Hope it wasn't in Umberto Eco's novel, Foucault's Pendulum.
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Joined: 1/22/2013 Posts: 17
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I've decided to publish my work through Book Country's publishing avenue. I'm going to republish both of my books, and the serial memoir I'm writing (I just published its first three-episode volume through Book Country). I'd love to talk with people in several genre in here, but it'd be great if you had the one I write in, which is creative nonfiction, specifically memoir. Is it possible to add this category/genre? Thanks.
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Joined: 6/18/2012 Posts: 228
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We want to keep the level of peer reviews high. It doesn't help me as a writer if you tell me my work is good in exchange for me doing the same with your book. I think you're right about having a measurement for quality of writing, especially in relation to each genre. We'll think about that...
Your timing is perfect: we're working on the genre map right now and trying to figure out the nomenclature we're going to use.
The second-level categories (henceforth always referred to as the "sentient coffee drink" labels) are complex. I'll expand on them in a different thread (or maybe on the blog).
We are expanding to memoir this summer.
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Joined: 2/21/2013 Posts: 40
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One thing, trivial perhaps. I would love to be able to see most recent posts fist, instead of last, or, alternatively, have the thread automatically take you to the last post when you click into it.
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Joined: 2/9/2012 Posts: 427
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Not trivial at all. We want to make the site as intuitive to use as possible.
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Joined: 2/22/2013 Posts: 5
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Presumably we're all here for feedback on our own writing. I found Authonomy exasperating in the extreme because one had to spend an inordinate amount of time spamming and otherwise coercing people to read and comment on one's work in reciprocation for doing the same to theirs. I'd like to see a mechanism whereby having reviewed somebody's work, the review is only activated after they have returned the favour. Such a system would be fair and eliminate parasites who do not enter into the spirit of the site.
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Joined: 2/21/2013 Posts: 40
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I don't think forcing reciprocity in this way is a good idea. Some people review actively,others don't. An alternative might be to indicate the number of reviews a given person has posted to give potential reviewers an idea of how active that person is. Then they can make their own decision on whether it is worth their time to review that person's work. But I am uncomfortable even with this. We should be reviewing candidly, not with an eye to getting a (presumably) favorable review in return. That is what Authonomy does, and it undermines the whole notion of having reviews in the first place. Of course, people engage in this review mania on Authonomy in order to get HarperCollins to look at and maybe publish them. But, in fact, only a small handful (or less) of Authonomy writers have actually been published. It's a bit of a scam, according to some comments I have read.
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Joined: 4/27/2011 Posts: 608
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@TPNiedermann: I couldn't agree more. And there is this: writing is one thing, critiquing another. Those of us (most of us?) working two or more jobs just to stay afloat have limited reserves of energy with which to write and read. Expending that energy on the work of another is fraught with potential disaster: You may alienate another writer, make a fool of yourself with unfounded/inexpert criticisms and/or waste time better spent working on your own writing.
Take your own book, for instance: I’ve read the opening chapters. Excellent writing. 4-5 stars in just about every category. Nevertheless there were a couple of stylistic things I considered commenting on. Now, do I waste hours formatting up a review when I read in your bio that you’ve taught writing at Yale and McGill? Only to have you turn to my own bio and thunder, after a quick eyeball of the particulars there (channeling Nabokov): “Who is this presumptuous, jumped-up little bourgeoise sales clerk who dares to pronounce on the quality of my writing?”
Or take another example: A stranger reviews my writing. They are not a fan. They post a critical (but constructive) review. I consider their criticisms as carefully and objectively as I can, respond cordially and then go on to read their own fiction on the site. Uh-oh: 2-3 star territory. Do I post the review? Only to have that writer read my review with a jaundiced eye, the while thinking to themselves: “I get it—retaliation. That’s all this hit-piece is; retaliation, plain and simple.”
So who gets reviewed? Writers I trust. Writers I like. Writers I feel are professional, talented and thick-skinned enough to hear what I am saying about their posted work and are capable of responding: (a) thanks; I missed that (b) hmmm . . . not sure I agree; I’ll have to think about it, and (c) you’re dead wrong and here’s why, bucko . . .
If this sounds like a highly idiosyncratic, helter-skelter and inexact method for finding writers to review on Book Country, I plead guilty—but I wouldn’t want it any other way. I follow writers in the discussion threads—the more they contribute, the more likely I am to review their work. But if I don’t get around to reviewing every writer I’d like to it isn’t because I find their work fundamentally flawed but rather that I’ve weighed the time-expenditure of half-a-day spent reading and reviewing work (which could disappear as soon as I post a review) versus doing something else. Sadly, it's oftentimes “something else” that wins out.
I don’t want any of my reviewers feeling pressure to read and critique new work by me and I, in return, reserve the right to reserve my critical writing for when and where “the spirit moves me.”
The randomness, free-wheeling dialogue and sublime serendipitous moments of found synchronicity and shared camaraderie are part-and-parcel of Book Country’s unique charm.
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Joined: 2/21/2013 Posts: 40
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Carl,
Great post, . . .and many thanks for the compliment.
Tim
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Joined: 6/18/2012 Posts: 228
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I love the discussion that's happening here.
I shared your comments with the development team as we discussed reviewing today... As always, very helpful and appreciative.
@Carl I agree about not wanting reviewers to feel pressure or feel like they're getting/giving tit-for-tat reviews. I think that would break the spirit of Book Country. That said, it's also intimidating for new members to figure out who to review. You're in the eagle's nest -- you have a list of writers you trust and like and that you know can handle it. How do we help people who don't have your knowledge?
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Joined: 2/21/2013 Posts: 40
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We need to enable reviewers and enable writers. The two are not the same, but we obviously need them both. Reviewers should be rewarded separately from writers. How? I have no idea. But we have to come up with a mechanism that respects both talents. If we can do this, the reviews will be more honest and writers won't feel they have to spend hours upon hours doing the sort of marketing that keeps them from their primary task of writing. In your court BookCountry.
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Joined: 8/21/2011 Posts: 394
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Some suggestions, wishes, etc.:
1. I would love for there to be an easier way to upload (or delete) multiple chapters at a time. The number of clicks/keystrokes involved to upload or delete just one chapter is maddening! After I've worked on several chapters, I'm ready to shut down my laptop.
2. The review windows are too tiny. (I think we've all mentioned that one.)
3. I'm so used to doing inline edits and inserting comments through Word's track changes, it would be great if there were a way to do that now while reviewing a work. I realize this would mean doing something with versioning. On the other hand, if a writer wants a reviewer to do a line edit, would it be possible to make that an option?
4. The comments under a review seem to reorder themselves into some sort of weird non-chronological fashion.
5. The site in general seems to respond very slowly (and I have fairly high-speed connections at home and at work). It takes a long time, for example, to click through all my connections to see what they've been up to.
6. The ability to set up some sort of keyword-associated alert to let you know when new discussions (or comments in existing discussions) that may be of interest to you are posted. I rarely wade through the directory of discussions - there are so many and the response time while navigating through them all is slow.
7. The respond box on discussion threads could be a bit bigger, too.
8. Mobile versions of BC for Android and iOS systems?
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Joined: 4/27/2011 Posts: 608
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@Brandi: That's a very good question! (How do we get new members to figure out who to review?)
I think (like most of here on Book Country) that new members will automatically gravitate towards the genres they like reading and writing most. Book Country's "Waiting To Be Discovered" section helps pull eyeballs to un-reviewed texts; perhaps a "Needs Further Reviews" section could flag those texts that don’t yet have, say, a dozen reviews.
You might also think about creating a point-weighted scoring system towards unlocking some kind of intra-site reward: free professionally-designed book covers for your BC published texts, for instance; the underwriting (in partial or full) of self-publishing costs, etc.
For the truly hesitant and unschooled a brief “How To Give Constructive Criticism” exercise might ease reviewers into the waters. Example: BC creates a sample “target text”; the new reviewer could elect to review this text and then have a BC staff member review their review and award points toward full membership and posting privileges.
Perhaps one out of every five (or six, or eight, or ten) reviews given could be made anonymously? (Though more points and unlocking privileges would be given for self-identified reviews.)
Create a high-scoring, ranked-in-order, top-100 “Most Trusted & Helpful Reviewers on Book Country” table.
Just spit-balling here . . .
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Joined: 11/17/2011 Posts: 1016
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I am so very insecure about reviewing. I'm very aware of my lack of formal education. I always have opinions, but I frequently wonder if I've misunderstood (or ignored) the nature of a piece, and criticized a book for not being what I'd like it to be instead of working within the expectations of the genre. Could we have a buddy system, a friend who looks over a review and explains to me what I've got wrong, before I post it, or after, I guess that would work too.
I would be glad if someone would say, look, you're full of shit, and here's why. This is my creative writing education here, on the cheap.
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Joined: 10/14/2012 Posts: 229
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Don't expect anything too deep from me;
When posting a discussion comment, the 'scroll down key' is practically on top of the 'cancel' tab. I've fallen foul of this a few times and fear the scroll arrow like an underwater flash of white while swimming warm waters. Also, how are the review stars averaged. They're not mode or mean, do some reviews carry more weight than others? At one point I'd averaged 4, but had 2. Jay has since narrowed the gap, cheers buddy! It's not that stars themselves matter, other than their lack may deter others from offering reviews.
P.S. Mimi, I think all reviews and opinions are useful. Everyone has the option to apply, ignore, or wait until they hear something twice before reacting. You know the saying......If someone tells you, you're dead, call them on it: If 10 people tell you, you're dead.......lay down. And, of course, your reviews are loving, thoughtful, insightful, comprehensive, heartfelt, unique to you, and informative. (Not that I'd ever suck up for one, naturally.)
Mike
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Joined: 11/17/2011 Posts: 1016
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You are sweet, Michael. My biggest failing is that, when insight fails, I settle for being entertaining. I put on my clown nose and my clown shoes and work that angle for all it's worth.
It's both a cop-out and the result of insufficient education, which I've never felt as keenly as I do on this site.
Huh! I ducked out, now I'm back in a flash, with an insight, yet. In reading a comment on Sarah Palin at this weekend's CPAC, it has come to me that she and I have something in common. What we lack in gravitas, we make up for with folksy incoherence.
Works for me.
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Re: Brandi's question, "How do we help people who don't have your knowledge?"
Maybe we could have a way to communicate directly with new members. Nothing beats a personal touch.
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We need better message board software. What we've had all this time is the pits. I don't like it. I've complained about it from day one.
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Also, the genre map. I have myself listed as "Contemporary Fantasy, Urban Fantasy, Horror, Paranormal Mystery" which isn't accurate. What I write is more Paranormal/Fantasy - my publisher calls it Southern Gothic. There's also no way to differentiate between Adult, Young Adult, Children's, etc. I write both Adult and YA, but my current projects are all YA.
And I keep getting asked if there's a place specifically for teen writers here?
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One more thing. It would be great if the Industry Blog (and its subsections) came with RSS feeds - or something. RSS would be ideal, though. There's so much I've missed over there simply because I didn't know it was even there. Other users of Book Country are probably in the same position.
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Joined: 2/9/2012 Posts: 427
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Hi there, Mari--
Excellent genre suggestions. I'm happy to share that we'll be opening up the site to teen fiction in the summer, so there will be many YA subcategories.
Btw, the Industry Blog does have an RSS feed! Go over to the Industry Blog homepage: http://bookcountry.com/industry/. You'll find the orange square for the feed in the upper left corner. Enjoy!
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Oh good, thank you!!
(also - be in touch with Colleen - I'm sure she remembers all my site gripes LOL)
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Joined: 2/9/2012 Posts: 427
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Haha, sounds good!
P.S. The forums will be much easier to use. I hadn't seen that particular note before.
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Yeah - it's been my biggest complaint since day one.
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Joined: 4/4/2013 Posts: 18
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1. Is there a review category for Language? By this I mean over use of modifiers/adverbs, Tom Swifties, etc. Too frequent use of words or phases which become distracting. Sentence flow and structure. Did I make my point clear, I ask pointedly?
2. It might just be my browser (Safari on Mac), but the location of the cursor in the reviewing box is not apparent, and the box doesn't always show the location in which I am typing. I have finally figured out that the only way to write a coherent review is in notepad/textedit and then to cut and paste. With apologies to the three whose works I have reviewed to date, since those reviews were written in the little boxes and were rather incomplete, and perhaps even curt.
3. Could BC establish a policy of eliminating/banning spammy sales posts masquerading as books in need of critique? Posts in which the last lines of text read something like: "If you liked this sample, you can buy the full book on Amazon." WTF. Yes, I critiqued anyway, just to get my crit count over the minimum threshold, but …. arrg.
TTFN
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Joined: 8/21/2011 Posts: 394
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Something I would like - I don't remember from one day to the next what forums I participated in, who I connected with, and so on. Would it be possible to see all of my activities the same way I see those of the people I'm connected to or following? That is, the little box next to their photo with a number that, once clicked on, opens up a pop-up with a list of all they've done since the last time you viewed their profile.
Another thing (and forgive me if I've mentioned this before or if someone else did), I'd be interested in knowing who's following me.
I'd also like a way to see all of my posts/reviews/comments on reviews organized somehow (sort of like you can go to your Facebook home page and see all your posts in reverse chronological order - not that I'm suggesting we take on too many FB characteristics!).
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Joined: 4/4/2013 Posts: 18
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As Jay is fond of pointing out, peer critiques can be a bit of the blind leading the blind - I know - cliche - so what if you had, say weekly, a professional editor critique and make specific suggestions to the first 2500 words of a manuscript. Author permission required. That way we could gain insight into what the industry really looks at/for.
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